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Post by Tecuala Juggernauts on Dec 25, 2010 18:01:24 GMT -5
$426,000 for 2011
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Post by Deleted on Dec 26, 2010 10:12:36 GMT -5
we are allowed to pick-up players?
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Post by Tecuala Juggernauts on Dec 26, 2010 11:48:14 GMT -5
we are allowed to pick-up players? Matt added Aubrey Huff a few days ago (just didn't post it here.) Also, Gary, you added Mark Teahen to your keepers on December 31 last year, so I figured I was allowed to add anybody who was a free agent before the keeper deadline this year. If the rule has changed, I'll drop the guys I added immediately.
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Post by Nuke LaLoosh Express on Dec 26, 2010 12:02:29 GMT -5
Add drops are good-to-go until midnight Jan. 1, 2011. That's the way we've always played
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Post by Tecuala Juggernauts on Dec 26, 2010 15:25:58 GMT -5
Add drops are good-to-go until midnight Jan. 1, 2011. That's the way we've always played Thanks for the clarification, Josh.
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Post by Nuke LaLoosh Express on Dec 26, 2010 18:06:52 GMT -5
No problem Colin, even though you picked up De La Rosa. Hope everyone had a great Christmas!
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Post by Bobby Ayala - Matt on Dec 26, 2010 18:13:59 GMT -5
Sorry, I was doing that in between family functions and forgot.
Aubrey Huff, $3mil (for next season)
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Post by Tecuala Juggernauts on Dec 26, 2010 19:15:16 GMT -5
No problem Colin, even though you picked up De La Rosa. Hope everyone had a great Christmas! Did I not wait long enough to pick him up? I waited more than 72 hours, and I honestly thought our waiver period was three days. Or are you just giving me shit because you're the one who dropped him?
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Post by Deleted on Dec 26, 2010 19:48:35 GMT -5
If we are allowing people to pick up players who are dropped, then i dont think we should encourage dropping your players ahead of time on ESPN.
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Post by Tecuala Juggernauts on Dec 26, 2010 22:10:20 GMT -5
If we are allowing people to pick up players who are dropped, then i dont think we should encourage dropping your players ahead of time on ESPN. Agreed. And sorry...I didn't know anyone was encouraging people to drop guys early. I know last year we all dropped guys at the last minute specifically so nobody could pick them up before the deadline.
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Post by C4 on Dec 26, 2010 23:10:57 GMT -5
I wasn't even looking at ESPN. I just assumed that the teams were locked at the end of the season. When we select our keepers, the others should go into the draft pool for next year. IMHO, there should not be any additions from guys who were owned at the end of the season. Just doesn't seem right.
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Post by Nuke LaLoosh Express on Dec 27, 2010 1:23:58 GMT -5
No problem Colin, even though you picked up De La Rosa. Hope everyone had a great Christmas! Did I not wait long enough to pick him up? I waited more than 72 hours, and I honestly thought our waiver period was three days. Or are you just giving me shit because you're the one who dropped him? Just simply giving you shit because I dropped him
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Post by Nuke LaLoosh Express on Dec 27, 2010 1:27:17 GMT -5
I wasn't even looking at ESPN. I just assumed that the teams were locked at the end of the season. When we select our keepers, the others should go into the draft pool for next year. IMHO, there should not be any additions from guys who were owned at the end of the season. Just doesn't seem right. I understand where you're coming from but on the other hand allowing teams to add and drop players until the deadline forces GM's to stay on top of everything.
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Post by Bobby Ayala - Matt on Dec 27, 2010 9:06:54 GMT -5
I wasn't even looking at ESPN. I just assumed that the teams were locked at the end of the season. When we select our keepers, the others should go into the draft pool for next year. IMHO, there should not be any additions from guys who were owned at the end of the season. Just doesn't seem right. We've always done it this way, Josh referenced Gary adding Teahan last year, and I dropped Drew Stubbs last year only to have someone pick him up and keep him. This is something maybe we should vote on for next season. Personally I like how it is now- having a deadline of Dec 31st, and anything that happens before is fair game.
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Post by fishmystic on Dec 27, 2010 16:28:13 GMT -5
Add drops are good-to-go until midnight Jan. 1, 2011. That's the way we've always played Eastern Time?
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Post by Bobby Ayala - Matt on Dec 27, 2010 17:33:39 GMT -5
Add drops are good-to-go until midnight Jan. 1, 2011. That's the way we've always played Eastern Time? Yes.
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Post by C4 on Dec 27, 2010 21:35:21 GMT -5
So, what advantage is created for an owner who drops players before the deadline? The only case would be if that manager were picking up a player to keep instead of one of the guys that he currently has. And even in that case, it would only be beneficial to drop the worst guy on your roster to make that move.
So, if an owner were truly looking out for only their own team, they would not release players into the pool until it was too late for them to be added by the other owners. And if it came down to timing, all that needs to be done is to post that your keepers are effective on a certain date (like the day before the keepers lock and rosters are frozen before the draft). I understand that this current system is the way that you guys have been playing, but it makes no sense to me why anyone would be releasing guys early. The only reason would be to intentionally help someone else's team.
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Post by Tecuala Juggernauts on Dec 27, 2010 22:09:19 GMT -5
I understand that this current system is the way that you guys have been playing, but it makes no sense to me why anyone would be releasing guys early. The only reason would be to intentionally help someone else's team. Um, well, another reason might be that some guys have lives. You know, like maybe they have other responsibilities for a few days and won't be able to be near a computer? I don't know why Jackson dropped guys on December 20, but I do know he hasn't logged on since the morning of December 21, which is very unlike him...so I have to conclude that he's got things going on that necessitate him being away, and he knew about it in advance. Besides, dropping guys early could only assuredly help ONE team: the team with the highest waiver position. In the cases of the guys I picked up, I waited almost five days on two of them and almost three days on the other. Clearly, they had passed through waivers and nobody had claimed them. Anybody could have picked up Torres or Zobrist for at least two days before I did.
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Post by C4 on Dec 27, 2010 22:26:24 GMT -5
I wasn't going to pick them up regardless, and I am not trying to be an ass, but I still do not see how dropping guys early does any good for the team who is dropping them. I am just not seeing the logic behind it. When you are able to be online should not be a factor, as he could have said that his keepers will become official at 11:59 PM EST on the 31st. That would prevent anyone from grabbing them. Right?
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Post by Tecuala Juggernauts on Dec 28, 2010 0:06:57 GMT -5
Be that as it may, every owner chooses when to drop their players. In this case, everybody was playing within the rules, and nobody did anything that hadn't been done before in this league.
In this league, as long as I've been in it, you have to physically drop players before the keeper deadline. You can't just say, "These are my keepers effective this date" and imply that everyone else is unavailable until the draft. Maybe when you are able to be online should not be a factor, as you say, but in this league it is a factor.
And by the way, please be careful how you phrase things around here, especially when you accuse someone in a veiled manner of an action that "would be to intentionally help someone else's team." I love this league, I would never collude with another owner to help any team gain an unfair advantage, and I don't appreciate being on the receiving end of that comment. We talk a lot of shit here about a lot of things, and I give and take a lot of it, but collusion is one topic that shouldn't be approached lightly.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 28, 2010 9:51:50 GMT -5
I think we should set a date that players can be added until, like 12/20 or something. Then there is a week or two grace period for getting non-keepers dropped and get draft cheat sheets updated.
I just feel that allowing teams to add and keep players that finished the season on another team's roster without giving anything up via trade defeats the whole purpose of keepers and building depth.
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Post by Bobby Ayala - Matt on Dec 28, 2010 11:04:11 GMT -5
I think we should set a date that players can be added until, like 12/20 or something. Then there is a week or two grace period for getting non-keepers dropped and get draft cheat sheets updated. I agree with this. I also don't think anyone is dropping players to intentionally help another team. Jackson was actively shopping those guys before the deadline and obviously no one was biting. I imagine you probably could've given him your last draft pick for Zorilla and he would've taken it-- not much difference than just picking him up for free. I think he probably thought, since no one wanted to trade for them, that no one would keep them, so why not just drop them and declare keepers and take a week off. Player values are real tricky before the keeper deadline, and I've seen it in many leagues I've played in (in my hockey league I tried to trade a number of players before the keeper deadline, but no one even make me an offer-- then 3 of them went in the top 5 of the draft.)
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Post by fishmystic on Dec 28, 2010 11:22:38 GMT -5
I put Jhonny Peralta out on waivers because of a secret deal with another manager who desperately wanted him. Now you guys have scared him off
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Post by C4 on Dec 31, 2010 7:44:49 GMT -5
I am NOT accusing anyone of anything. That is you twisting what I said. What I am (still) trying to say is that there is absolutely NO VALID REASON to drop players prior to the deadline. Doing so gives your team no advantage, and benefits ONLY the team who is picking up your dropped players. If that's the first guy in line, fine then it benefits him. If it's the last guy in line, so be it.
All I am saying is that I DO NOT UNDERSTAND why people would opt to do it. Like the Commish said, anyone who wasn't physically dropped (and wasn't listed as a keeper) will be dropped by the Commish at the deadline. So knowing that there is no requirement to drop them early, why would someone do it?
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Post by Tecuala Juggernauts on Dec 31, 2010 18:58:52 GMT -5
My bad, I must have missed the Commish saying he would automatically drop players who weren't kept. I don't think we did it that way last year, so I assume Jackson felt like he needed to take care of his roster before he went out of town. In my mind that would be a VALID REASON.
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Post by Rusty Trombones - Jackson on Jan 1, 2011 11:16:21 GMT -5
I knew I was going to be out of town and dropped those players so I wouldnt hold up other owners cheat sheets. I guess it wasn't ideal but we have enough owners who are slow with that stuff and I didnt want to contribute to the problem. Also like Matt said I didn't get any offers for any of those players so I didn't think it was a big deal to drop them. I still don't. I'm fine with adding a deadline to not pick guys up or whatever, but I certainly didn't drop those players to help anyone, just wanted to go on vacation and not think about fantasy baseball.
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Post by C4 on Jan 2, 2011 10:36:43 GMT -5
OK...Horse successfully beaten...now let's get 2011 rolling and see if I can't finish a few spots higher this year
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Post by Severe Punishment on Jan 2, 2011 11:12:13 GMT -5
please forgive me if my comments are redundant..I've tried to read every word of this thread.. but I have a few things on this especially since my team sucks and I'm more likely to "SNAG" players off the Free Agent list that others drop before the deadline.
Most of us are in this league to be as far away as "Fantasy" as possible... we want this league to resemble as close as the real thing as possible. Having 2 or 3 owners be buddy buddy, and make trades with each other and show favoritism is what happens in real life....or even dropping players before the deadline to help the teams at the bottom get better. It creates a competative disadvantage to owners who are NOT in good favor because of one way or another... that is a part of the game.
I don't see the big deal in colluding with other managers to help other managers out.... I mean... aren't we all big boys here? you might think it's a slippery slope, but I just think the word COLLUSION is looked at as such a horrible thing, rather than a... relationship builder or do whatever it takes to win strategy. We collude with the people we know can get a trade done. If your a part of the "out crowd" then sorry for you. Your're telling me your going to offer the same trade to a VETERAN in the SANDLOT than a ROOKIE in his 1st Year... noo... your going to try to FUCK HIM!!! get the most value you can.... get serious guys.. that's collusion.... I'm going to offer more value in a trade with Colin because we've played with each other in the past and we started at the same time..... it's natural selection. I know he's good to scratch my back down the line...... I might be looked at as a douche but that's real life. I just don't see the problem with trading me Prince Fielder for next to nothing....if that is what the owner wants to do. OK>.... here's my solution to "Free Agent for Nothing" problem.. so please read on!!
So if we do want to prevent players being picked up for nothing I think we should impliment a SANDWICH PICK system that would gain extra MiLB draft picks or even draft slots for players that are picked up during this "Free Agent for Nothing period"
we all know how it works.. If I would have picked up Magglio... either I would have lost a pick or the previous owner would have gained one.... not sure if that was brought up, but it's easy to impliment.... so.. dead horse is twitching... I just had some Sunday morning free time.
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Post by Bobby Ayala - Matt on Jan 2, 2011 13:08:31 GMT -5
Most of us are in this league to be as far away as "Fantasy" as possible... we want this league to resemble as close as the real thing as possible. Having 2 or 3 owners be buddy buddy, and make trades with each other and show favoritism is what happens in real life....or even dropping players before the deadline to help the teams at the bottom get better. It creates a competative disadvantage to owners who are NOT in good favor because of one way or another... that is a part of the game. I don't see the big deal in colluding with other managers to help other managers out.... I mean... aren't we all big boys here? you might think it's a slippery slope, but I just think the word COLLUSION is looked at as such a horrible thing, rather than a... relationship builder or do whatever it takes to win strategy. We collude with the people we know can get a trade done. If your a part of the "out crowd" then sorry for you. Your're telling me your going to offer the same trade to a VETERAN in the SANDLOT than a ROOKIE in his 1st Year... noo... your going to try to FUCK HIM!!! get the most value you can.... get serious guys.. that's collusion.... I'm going to offer more value in a trade with Colin because we've played with each other in the past and we started at the same time..... it's natural selection. I know he's good to scratch my back down the line...... I might be looked at as a douche but that's real life. I just don't see the problem with trading me Prince Fielder for next to nothing....if that is what the owner wants to do. OK>.... here's my solution to "Free Agent for Nothing" problem.. so please read on!! I don't think you're a douche. Yes, we'll offer different values in trades with different people, yes, we'll take advantage of what we know about a manager's motivation to acquire or dump a particular player, THAT is real life and fair as far as I'm concerned. (who said "Everything is Worth What a Purchaser Will Pay For It"?) If you give your buddy a discount, whatever, that's your loss, it means you're not getting the maximum value for your asset. If I offer you a 7th round pick for a player and you say no, and you turn around and trade the same player to Colin for a 9th round player, not only did you not get maximum return, but you're going to have a harder time trading with me in the future, because if I know you're giving him a buddy discount, it's going to make me a little upset. You're also setting up an expectation that Colin will do the same for you, and if he doesn't (or you perceive he doesn't,) that could put a strain between you two. But with the issue of supposedly dropping players just so another manager will get them for free (which I don't think happened here,) if anyone did that, or made a trade that they consciously knew they were making only to help another team and not themselves, that is collusion. "Collusion" is defined as a secret agreement for fraudulent, treacherous, and/or illegal purposes; I will go ahead and continue to look at that as a horrible thing. If a major league team did that and was caught, there would be serious ramifications, penalties, firings, suspensions, etc. If two teams did that here and we had some kind of proof, I would vote to kick them both out. That is not fair, and I like to play fair games. I operate under the assumption that all games have an unwritten code of conduct, and collusion violates that. That being said, I haven't seen an example of collusion yet in this league. The nature of our league, being a long-term dynasty league, hopefully eliminates any chance that someone would sell Prince Fielder for nothing, because the ramifications of that would be felt for many seasons to come. If you did that, you're either stupid, or you're colluding.
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Post by Rusty Trombones - Jackson on Jan 2, 2011 13:49:06 GMT -5
If Colin wasn't a fag and had just given me a 20th rounder for Zorilla this all would have been avoided. Colin you fag.
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